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Reagan is Bush's model

One of the arguments that seems to be gaining ground in Europe - perhaps especially on the centre-left - is that we need to build up our military capability, not because we're gonna use it, but because Washington is not gonna listen otherwise. So we will pursue a stronger, more technologically advanced army, to make the Americans listen - it's influence will be 'by extension', through that which we will exert on the US. 

DH: Well, yeah, that's one of many arguments for why Europeans should develop their military. I don't think it's the decisive one, but I think there is an element of truth to it. 

Could it be one in order to persuade the voters? Would it be your impression that the notion of having a strong military, preemptive strikes and so forth is still so foreign to many Europeans that it is necessary to coach it in those terms? 

DH: I don't think that carries weight with voters, because voters say: "Why are you spending my money? Because you think you can whisper in the ear of George Bush?" I think that doesn't go very far! I think voters wanna know why you're spending their money and that you should be spending it to advance their own interests or protect them or ensure their freedom or their prosperity. And I think any government will have to answer those tests. In a democracy you make these decisions because they're good for your country, not because it's some favour or some pretension that influences somebody else. 

My impression was, correct me if I am wrong, that the debate domestically in America changed a couple of months ago, when the Democratic challengers for the Presidential nomination started to speak out against George Bush and the war - the criticism became a lot more vocal. Is that true? 

DH: Oh yes, we're in a very, very deep debate. We have been - it's just that I think often European observers - as is normal - are analyzing America according to European standards, and then say 'there was no debate'. Well, we don't have a party system as you do in Europe - we don't look to the leaders of the party of the opposition to 'present the other view'. Our parties are catch-all parties that only exist during election time in any real sense, they're not a parliamentary system. So to say there is no debate has always been wrong - what we've seen is two things that come together now to make it more of a profile. One is, we're starting the Presidential election and the Democratic candidates are all out there now, fighting each other as much as they fight the President, and need to raise their profile. We have 10 candidates.

The other is that the post-Iraq-war-situation has gone very badly for the Administration. And it has been clear that having the Pentagon in charge of this has been a mistake of the greatest significance - and that they have seemed to be incapable of planning the peace. You have American soldiers shot and killed every day or every other day. This is having an impact on our domestic debate. 

How significant is that latest change - demotion is a strong word, but the setting of this new Iraqi Administration Council under Condoleeza Rice? 

DH: I don't think very significant. I think it shows their panic, almost, within the administration - that the President's poll numbers are going down. 

It is not seen as 'the end of the neo-conservative doctrine of foreign policy'? 

DH: Well, we'll see. There is a difference here between the sort of Bush-senior types of conservatives and the neo-conservatives. Both are fighting within the Bush administration. I think one sees that the neo-conservatives' views on some of these issues are somewhat in retreat, but they're ferocious fighters and they're not backing down at all. You see as usual the conflict within the administration between different viewpoints: in the end, it is the president who has to decide this, and he has not shown much inclination to side with the more Bush-senior-types. The current George Bush's presidential model is more Ronald Reagan than his own father.

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 Illustrationsfoto: The White House (Tina Hager)

Portrætfoto: American Institute for Contemporary German Studies, The Johns Hopkins University